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      NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC

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      notorious1985
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22816: Aug 08, 2017 05:40:35 pm
      If I'm not wrong Notorious is the brother of Corbally..

      I think he admitted that in a post.

      Spot on
      Brian78
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22817: Aug 08, 2017 08:30:38 pm
      Think this bird has flown
      redkop63
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22818: Aug 09, 2017 11:51:04 am
      Everything has gone according to the script like the last 7 years and FSG must be very happy and if Cou is sold, they'll be even happier. Nothing new to shout about, max 35 mil, that's where FSG standard is at the moment.
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22819: Aug 09, 2017 12:20:27 pm
      Everything has gone according to the script like the last 7 years and FSG must be very happy and if Cou is sold, they'll be even happier. Nothing new to shout about, max 35 mil, that's where FSG standard is at the moment.

      remind me how much FSG have taken out of the club?
      bigmick
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22820: Aug 09, 2017 12:30:48 pm
      When they sell up you mean? Probs about a billion quid or so I should think. I personally don't even begrudge them making a profit, I just wish they'd allow us to compete on the pitch while they're doing it. If for instance their target was doubling their initial investment, or even trebling it, I think we could still have a good go every season. As it is I fear that's not the case.

      I've seen this question about "taking money out of the club" before though. To my mind, constantly seeing the value of their initial investment spiral whilst also making profits year on year is simply putting money aside to be "taken out" at a later date.
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22821: Aug 09, 2017 01:02:40 pm
      remind me how much FSG have taken out of the club?

      Remind me of our league positions, trophies won, net spends per transfer window and how much the club is worth now compared to when they bought us.
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22822: Aug 09, 2017 01:07:32 pm
      When they sell up you mean? Probs about a billion quid or so I should think. I personally don't even begrudge them making a profit, I just wish they'd allow us to compete on the pitch while they're doing it. If for instance their target was doubling their initial investment, or even trebling it, I think we could still have a good go every season. As it is I fear that's not the case.

      I've seen this question about "taking money out of the club" before though. To my mind, constantly seeing the value of their initial investment spiral whilst also making profits year on year is simply putting money aside to be "taken out" at a later date.

      BigMick it makes no sense for them to do that, I wrote a post on this yesterday, the summary was that in both a short term and long term view it makes no sense for FSG to sell the clubs prized assets and funnel the cash back into the club because if they hold a long term view then they clearly like , or even love, the club and want success, ie don't sell your best players, if they hold a short term view then they want to maximise the brand value with an eye on selling it in the future which you do not do by selling your best players and putting the cash in the bank.
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22823: Aug 09, 2017 01:09:53 pm
      Remind me of our league positions, trophies won, net spends per transfer window and how much the club is worth now compared to when they bought us.

      2nd a few years ago then wilderness for a few years, then a couple of finals including Europa league, then 4th last year in the league and Champions league football to look forward to this season, what's your point here?

      Anyway how much money have the owners taken out of the club, please answer the question?
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22824: Aug 09, 2017 01:34:00 pm
      2nd a few years ago then wilderness for a few years, then a couple of finals including Europa league, then 4th last year in the league and Champions league football to look forward to this season, what's your point here?

      Anyway how much money have the owners taken out of the club, please answer the question?

      I didn't see anybody say they had? So what's your point?

      We've won a League Cup in their time here. Do you think that is good enough? Or are they still learning?
      FL Red
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22825: Aug 09, 2017 01:36:07 pm
      I didn't see anybody say they had? So what's your point?

      We've won a League Cup in their time here. Do you think that is good enough? Or are they still learning?

      Mother-heckin BOOM!!!
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22826: Aug 09, 2017 01:46:10 pm
      I didn't see anybody say they had? So what's your point?

      We've won a League Cup in their time here. Do you think that is good enough? Or are they still learning?

      I think we are on the right path and yes I do think we will have success. I also prefer to have owners who run the club sensibly rather than the Russian mafia or Arab Oil money being pumped into the club artificially.
      This summers signings are not a reflection of the owners not wanting to spend but rather the stubbornness of the manager in only wanting to sign players who would improve the team, I kind of agree with Jürgen on that.

      My point about the money taken out of the club or not, is that if the club are making money hand over fist with new TV deals, sponsorships etc then the only reason why the owners would not sanction any transfers would be if they were siphoning money out of the club, but they aren't doing that, to the best of my knowledge, so i therefore think the reason we are not signing anyone is not down to the owners but rather down to the manager.
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22827: Aug 09, 2017 01:46:41 pm

      Wow, simple minds etc ;-)
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22828: Aug 09, 2017 02:02:26 pm
      I think we are on the right path and yes I do think we will have success.

      Enough said. We have won one trophy in their time here and the manager who won that was sacked at the end of that season.

      But at least they're sensible.
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22829: Aug 09, 2017 02:30:36 pm
      Enough said. We have won one trophy in their time here and the manager who won that was sacked at the end of that season.

      But at least they're sensible.

      You seem to have some confusion about path and destination. Let me clarify for you. Have we achieved enough yet, absolutely 100% not, are we now moving in the right direction to achieve success, in my opinion yes we are, in your opinion we clearly cannot do this without getting some Saudi prince as an owner who injects billions into the club.
      FL Red
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22830: Aug 09, 2017 02:34:44 pm
      You seem to have some confusion about path and destination. Let me clarify for you. Have we achieved enough yet, absolutely 100% not, are we now moving in the right direction to achieve success, in my opinion yes we are, in your opinion we clearly cannot do this without getting some Saudi prince as an owner who injects billions into the club.

      Moving in the right direction is one thing, moving there with some urgency and taking maximum advantage of our opportunities is another. Do you honestly think we've done everything possible to improve? Think last January, think this summer...think about the summer after Suarez left, think Torres leaving, etc.......

      We've been bumbling around for years now. Blame who you want, I don't really care, but just "moving in the right direction" doesn't cut it. We need to be calculated and unrelenting and strike while the iron's hot. This summer was supposed to be a new opportunity for us to return to the world stage, but we instead got caught with our pants down fondling ourselves, telling ourselves how great we are instead of going out and showing it.
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22831: Aug 09, 2017 03:16:35 pm
      You seem to have some confusion about path and destination. Let me clarify for you. Have we achieved enough yet, absolutely 100% not, are we now moving in the right direction to achieve success, in my opinion yes we are, in your opinion we clearly cannot do this without getting some Saudi prince as an owner who injects billions into the club.

      Let me clarify? Shut up you, you jumped up little Tory tw*t.

      Tell me where I've mentioned Saudi billions? You're one of them who isn't as arsed as others about on the pitch success. You know, what its all about.

      It's fine, I understand and would expect that from somebody who doesn't really support the club.

      The day I take Liverpool Football Club lessons from some foreign Thatcher loving w*nk stain is the day I haven't got a hole in my F***ing arse.
      American Red
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22832: Aug 09, 2017 04:00:23 pm
      Moving in the right direction is one thing, moving there with some urgency and taking maximum advantage of our opportunities is another. Do you honestly think we've done everything possible to improve? Think last January, think this summer...think about the summer after Suarez left, think Torres leaving, etc.......

      We've been bumbling around for years now. Blame who you want, I don't really care, but just "moving in the right direction" doesn't cut it. We need to be calculated and unrelenting and strike while the iron's hot. This summer was supposed to be a new opportunity for us to return to the world stage, but we instead got caught with our pants down fondling ourselves, telling ourselves how great we are instead of going out and showing it.

      This wasn't the first time we've got caught with our pants down fondling ourselves after a successful season either. Seems like we just may be incapable of having the killer instinct when the time is right as you alluded to. We didn't need any kind of injection of billions of dollars this summer. What we needed was to hold on to what we had (chance of us doing that) and to improve on our problem areas (seems very unlikely).

      This has nothing to do with having ridiculous money, this has to do with following a standard progression of a club who wants to be a very serious contender for the title. Rather, we seem to be just dipping our toes in the water afraid to dive in.
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22833: Aug 09, 2017 04:11:20 pm
      Moving in the right direction is one thing, moving there with some urgency and taking maximum advantage of our opportunities is another. Do you honestly think we've done everything possible to improve? Think last January, think this summer...think about the summer after Suarez left, think Torres leaving, etc.......

      We've been bumbling around for years now. Blame who you want, I don't really care, but just "moving in the right direction" doesn't cut it. We need to be calculated and unrelenting and strike while the iron's hot. This summer was supposed to be a new opportunity for us to return to the world stage, but we instead got caught with our pants down fondling ourselves, telling ourselves how great we are instead of going out and showing it.

      What should the club have done then? Presumably not bid for Keita at all or walked away quicker and I do agree they fu**ed up with VVD initially, but beyond that what should they have done, just bought anyone, even though the manager didn't want them, isn't that what we used to do under Brendan, remind me how well that worked out?
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22834: Aug 09, 2017 04:14:14 pm
      Let me clarify? Shut up you, you jumped up little Tory tw*t.

      Tell me where I've mentioned Saudi billions? You're one of them who isn't as arsed as others about on the pitch success. You know, what its all about.

      It's fine, I understand and would expect that from somebody who doesn't really support the club.

      The day I take Liverpool Football Club lessons from some foreign Thatcher loving w*nk stain is the day I haven't got a hole in my f**king arse.

      Oh I expect you'll get lots of +1's for that one, well done you. Doesn't really matter that you once again failed miserably to address any of my points in a cogent or intelligent manner.
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22835: Aug 09, 2017 04:18:50 pm
      Oh I expect you'll get lots of +1's for that one, well done you. Doesn't really matter that you once again failed miserably to address any of my points in a cogent or intelligent manner.

      You haven't made any point whatsoever.

      You've agreed we've underachieved on the field under FSG. You think we're probably moving in the right direction but not said why you think that.

      You think all of that is sound, I don't.

      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22836: Aug 09, 2017 04:19:13 pm
      This wasn't the first time we've got caught with our pants down fondling ourselves after a successful season either. Seems like we just may be incapable of having the killer instinct when the time is right as you alluded to. We didn't need any kind of injection of billions of dollars this summer. What we needed was to hold on to what we had (chance of us doing that) and to improve on our problem areas (seems very unlikely).

      This has nothing to do with having ridiculous money, this has to do with following a standard progression of a club who wants to be a very serious contender for the title. Rather, we seem to be just dipping our toes in the water afraid to dive in.

      Out of interest what were our problem areas from last season in your opinion. From my pov one of them was LB where we have recruited a very good LB with Prem experience etc and it appears we have manage to condition Moreno into being able to defend, although its very early days on that one. Another area of weakness was on the wing where we have recruited a very good player in Salah. Another area was midfield where we tried very very hard to recruit Keita and th efinal area was CB where we are still trying, I hope, to recruit VVD.  I'll accept that I also wanted a better goalkeeper but we now have a 3-way battle for the jersey so hopefully they'll push each other along.
      heimdall
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22837: Aug 09, 2017 04:22:03 pm
      You haven't made any point whatsoever.

      You've agreed we've underachieved on the field under FSG. You think we're probably moving in the right direction but not said why you think that.

      You think all of that is sound, I don't.



      So please tell me, if you were the owner of LFC with a decent but not unlimited budget, ie not PSG, Chavs, Manure or Citeh, what would you be doing beyond trying to buy Keita and VVD?
      « Last Edit: Aug 09, 2017 04:30:12 pm by heimdall »
      American Red
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      Re: NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC
      Reply #22838: Aug 09, 2017 04:38:06 pm
      Out of interest what were our problem areas from last season in your opinion. From my pov one of them was LB where we have recruited a very good LB with Prem experience etc and it appears we have manage to condition Moreno into being able to defend, although its very early days on that one. Another area of weakness was on the wing where we have recruited a very good player in Salah. Another area was midfield where we tried very very hard to recruit Keita and th efinal area was CB where we are still trying, I hope, to recruit VVD.  I'll accept that I also wanted a better goalkeeper but we now have a 3-way battle for the jersey so hopefully they'll push each other along.

      We're having a similar discussion in another thread so I'll consolidate my response here and we can leave that one focused on the transfer rumors rather than on FSG.

      Our problem areas were:

      -GK: Migs and Karius were simply not good enough. If we want to give another season of trying to get Karius to actually push Migs, then I'm fine with that for now. Didn't expect us to improve spectacularly on what we had here.

      -CB: Matip was/is a very very good player. Lovren has improved steadily since his first season and is a solid CB, but I think we could see an improvement on him with a large investment. Look at the Spuds CBs, Alderweireld and Vertonghen are the quality of CBs we should be targeting. Lovren is not there. Klavan meanwhile was pretty awful and I would not trust him when we need him. Gomez has some good showings, but is too young still and seems he could be unreliable with injuries. We needed to invest here. Fine, we've been targeting VVD for months now, but we haven't landed him. We have our opener in 4 days and we're still scrambling for coverage at CB. Going into the season with what we have is a failure for this window - this is a gamble.

      -LB: As you mentioned. We've held on to Moreno, maybe he's improved, maybe he hasn't. Milner is aging and who knows if he'll be able to pull out performances like he had last season. Robertson is still young and in early days and played in a defense which gave up 80 goals while only scoring 37 in the PL. Our defense and keepers only conceited 42 (which was high) - maybe he'll be a great addition I don't know, but to me that is a gamble and not what I'd consider shoring up that position with a top class player.

      -CM: We don't have a great #6, we don't have a great #8, we do have a great #10 (maybe two if you count Lallana) and we've got three guys (Gini, Emre, and Hendo) who are good players, but seem like they're all still trying to figure out what types of players they wanted to be. Either way we need coverage there. We're seeing the likes of Woodburn and Kent being actually considered in people's lineups - maybe they're good talents, but that's not what a team who wants to fire on all cylinders and compete strongly for the PL title should be banking on. Going into the season without improving our CM is a gamble again and in my opinion was a failure.

      -General depth: Mentioned it before, we're going to be playing 55+ games this season and a club of our stature should be planning to win a vast majority of these games. Our first team may be pretty strong on it's day, but how's our second team? How's our depth at CB, how's our depth at CM, how's our depth in the attack if one of Mane goes down again? Is it strong/reliable/ready to fill the boots of our best? No, it's not.

      The point being is that we're valued as one of the top franchises in all of sports - top 10 in world football - and we have been for a very long while. I want to see us wake the f*ck up and start acting like it when the time comes, and with how we're positioned right now ahead of the season I think it's very clear that the time has come and I don't think we're acting like it.

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